The first article I read was called "The German Certificate Fetish." I found this very very interesting because I had no clue about any of this. The kind of system they talk about seems very strict and very different from the USA. In the US while applying for a job you just give them your simple 1 page resume and maybe meet them and if you meet their standards then they will call you back for interviewing processes. I have obviously never experienced the German way of getting all these documents proving certain things about what you did in your life but I am leaning towards liking the US way better. I feel like there are definitely weaknesses in both systems. In the German system, if you lose or damage you binder in anyway, it would be so much work to try and get it all back together because it is just a lot of papers. Also, I feel like it is a really big hassle to get all these papers signed and authenticated after you do certain things. Now, weaknesses in the US system is that people can easily fake, or mislead someone by putting false things on their resume with no authorization that it is true. This is where the German system is better because you know everything they have authenticated in the binder is true and that they actually did do it.
The next article I read was called "German Law Tells You How." I think after reading this article that there may be a lot more mean or grouchy people in Germany if all these conflicts with neighbors are coming up in courts and such. All of the rules listed were pretty common sense besides the specific times when you must shovel, be able to make noise, ect. I'm not positive on this but I do not really know any rules about neighboring, I think the subdivisions in the US makes specific rules for things like if your are allowed to have a fence or not, and what kind of mailbox you need to have...at least in my sub I think they make these rules. Usually, I think that if you are nice to your neighbors and respect their presence, then they will also respect yours and there won't be many problems.
The last article I read was "Don't Fly the Flag." I didn't know that German's had such little patriotism but it kind of makes sense due to their past with Hitler, the Berlin Wall, ect. It is very different than the United States because here in the US at sports games, or parties, or even other random events the crowd will sometimes just start chanting "USA! USA! USA!" for a certain reason because they are proud to live here and be an American. I am one of those people. Also, before I even started reading this it made me think of the World Cup because the Germans have been known to put some pretty good teams together and from what I know the whole country is behind them, and later in the article they talk about this.
I really enjoyed reading these culture articles about Germany and I actually learned quite a bit of interesting things that I had no idea about.
(Sorry this is so late by the way. I think I was home sick the day we did this and when I was catching up on the homework, I must of missed this assignment, but here it is!)
Posts mit dem Label Kultur 9 werden angezeigt. Alle Posts anzeigen
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Montag, 5. März 2012
Sonntag, 4. März 2012
Kultur 9
Germans absolutely love their bureaucracy. Living there for three months last summer required going to offices that I could not have imagined existed. I lived in one district over from the place where I worked, so there was the initial issue of figuring out which district's office I had to go to. For work-related things I had to go to the offices in Koblenz, but for living-related things I had to go to Mayen-Koblenz offices. This was very frustrating.
It is somewhat surprising to see that a culture that is so organized refuses to modernize. Technology has made the need for paper obsolete, or at least it has for me. Therefore, I was very disappointed to see that Germans had not embraced this technological advancement to make their daily lives easier.
No that I read about it, I never did see a German flag outside of official buildings and national landmarks. Being a WW2 buff, it is very interesting for me to learn about this and the reasons behind it. While they can be mislabeled as cold and evil, Germans are not so. While talking to many of them about the war, they simply said that it was a terrible evil done to others, and that it so happened that leaders were German. That s not who they were now. Therefore, I do think that this belief is slowly dying. Will it affect patriotism? Perhaps...
It is somewhat surprising to see that a culture that is so organized refuses to modernize. Technology has made the need for paper obsolete, or at least it has for me. Therefore, I was very disappointed to see that Germans had not embraced this technological advancement to make their daily lives easier.
No that I read about it, I never did see a German flag outside of official buildings and national landmarks. Being a WW2 buff, it is very interesting for me to learn about this and the reasons behind it. While they can be mislabeled as cold and evil, Germans are not so. While talking to many of them about the war, they simply said that it was a terrible evil done to others, and that it so happened that leaders were German. That s not who they were now. Therefore, I do think that this belief is slowly dying. Will it affect patriotism? Perhaps...
Montag, 20. Februar 2012
Kultur 9
I can't believe there is still a certificate system in Germany. What is the practicality of having a binder full of information on yourself in such a vulnerable situation?
Water damage, house/room fire, thefts, etc. could practically ruin a life. And to scan all of that into a computer? Oh sheesh, we're talking hours and hours of hard work for some bill receipts and pre-exam slips.
And to inhibit someone's ability to grill because of someone's inability to stand an at-most hour of grilled meat is absurd. I know back home, our family would grill every day during the summer. Brots are important! I couldn't deal with that if I moved there, I'd have to live somewhere out in the country or in a Stadt with a more lax enforcement of that law.
David
Kultur 9
Although this week's articles were surprising, yet enlightening as always, I'm not surprised to hear that the Germans love their paperwork and organization skills. I remember my history teacher mentioning this to us while we discussed World War2 and the Holocaust in that German's were extremely meticulous in their procedures.
It was actually kind of sad to hear that German's don't have pride in their history when in reality, their history extends way beyond just World War 2. They have such a rich, historic culture that it's depressing to see that they can't face their history to the point of not being able to answer a simple questions as "Do you love your country?" The fact that they can't even fly their tricolored flag is sad, and although the article mentions change, I hope that Germans can move on sooner rather than later and embrace their rich history.
Once again, there's an article that kind of makes you rethink your wishes to visit Germany. The "neighbor" article was weird; my first impression was "Wow, I don't want to live there," but I wonder if it truly is like this in reality. There are so many restrictions and although they do fall relatively close to the natural quiet/noisy zones, I can't help but think it be inconvenient at times to have those restrictions. Nonetheless, this article was also interesting and a gave a different insight into German life than the other two.
Kultur IX, von Jake DeBolt
I kind of want to live among these strange creatures we have named "Germans." Thes articles paint them as a somewhat peculiar, orderly sort. The first article, the one about the Certificate "fetish" seems to fit this light. Certificates are but a form of documentation, and most orderly folk appreciate this form of documentation. The idea of proof of one's accomplishments also rests behind these certificates, which I feel adds value to them. Germans seem to see the value of proof, and seem to see no reason to shy away from the burden of proof.
Now, the second article was... interesting to say the least. The idea of Germans being as uptight as the article suggests fulfills the angry German stereotype. I do feel, however, that this sort of thing is also true in the US, and I frankly wouldn't be surprised if the issue is overstated in the article. I understand that the author is merely trying to convey a convincing image of his days in Deutschland, but I feel that the image is turned into a caricature with the ammount of focus he places on his neighbor. Frankly, his idea of coexistence is universal: nothing excessive. Nobody likes hearing their neighbors' cruddy garage band practice their Rammstein cover at 1:00 AM. The digression on barbecuing seems to be something unique as well.
The third article, however, is definitely something uniquely German, and it is an issue that definitely stems from their history. The German people have learned the hard way that blind patriotism is extremely dangerous. The Third Reich utilized the post WWI hardships as a way to form a sense of nationalism among the people of Germany. This nationalist identity led to the death of millions of innocents, and it is understandable that the people of Germany tend to shy away from patriotism. Indeed, there is an argument that the nation-state may be in its dying days, as the increasing globalization of our economy and society takes effect. The idea of a nation brings with it severe limitations, and brings about competition in groups of people to prove who is better. This competition leads to wars, arms races, and other such disagreements. With the death of the nation, a global society may be that much more viable. Perhaps Germany, with its troubled past, is becoming the first to realize this...
Now, the second article was... interesting to say the least. The idea of Germans being as uptight as the article suggests fulfills the angry German stereotype. I do feel, however, that this sort of thing is also true in the US, and I frankly wouldn't be surprised if the issue is overstated in the article. I understand that the author is merely trying to convey a convincing image of his days in Deutschland, but I feel that the image is turned into a caricature with the ammount of focus he places on his neighbor. Frankly, his idea of coexistence is universal: nothing excessive. Nobody likes hearing their neighbors' cruddy garage band practice their Rammstein cover at 1:00 AM. The digression on barbecuing seems to be something unique as well.
The third article, however, is definitely something uniquely German, and it is an issue that definitely stems from their history. The German people have learned the hard way that blind patriotism is extremely dangerous. The Third Reich utilized the post WWI hardships as a way to form a sense of nationalism among the people of Germany. This nationalist identity led to the death of millions of innocents, and it is understandable that the people of Germany tend to shy away from patriotism. Indeed, there is an argument that the nation-state may be in its dying days, as the increasing globalization of our economy and society takes effect. The idea of a nation brings with it severe limitations, and brings about competition in groups of people to prove who is better. This competition leads to wars, arms races, and other such disagreements. With the death of the nation, a global society may be that much more viable. Perhaps Germany, with its troubled past, is becoming the first to realize this...
Sonntag, 19. Februar 2012
Kultur 9
Austria sounded very interesting. I have always wanted to visit central Europe and visit some of the historical sites, but rarely have I thought about visiting Wien. The cultural sites and historical sites surrounding the old Austria-Hungarian Empire specifically sounded interesting. I know from history that the old Austrian and German Empires were allies and shared many similar traits, so I wonder how much the states have in common with each other now. Visiting the two states in rapid succession would be really cool.
Also intriguing was the lack of German nationalism discussed in one of the articles. As an American, it is hard for me to imagine any nation with a dearth of outward national pride, especially a country with as much history and power as Germany. I understand the idea of repentance and embarrassment that must be prevalent amongst Germans, but I doubt their actions or lack of nationalism will ever cause anybody involved in either WWI or WWII to forget the conflict or the terrible prices that Europe and Asia had to pay. German modesty is wasted. The world will never forgive or understand, so why hold back on the national pride? It's actually extremely hypocritical, as countries all across world history have committed genocide and few of them ever have to deal with the guilt the Germans do. America in fact took part in a mass genocide of Indians for centuries, but no American withholds his patriotism in embarrassment. I hope one day Germany says screw the world and goes back to being staunch nationalists.
Also intriguing was the lack of German nationalism discussed in one of the articles. As an American, it is hard for me to imagine any nation with a dearth of outward national pride, especially a country with as much history and power as Germany. I understand the idea of repentance and embarrassment that must be prevalent amongst Germans, but I doubt their actions or lack of nationalism will ever cause anybody involved in either WWI or WWII to forget the conflict or the terrible prices that Europe and Asia had to pay. German modesty is wasted. The world will never forgive or understand, so why hold back on the national pride? It's actually extremely hypocritical, as countries all across world history have committed genocide and few of them ever have to deal with the guilt the Germans do. America in fact took part in a mass genocide of Indians for centuries, but no American withholds his patriotism in embarrassment. I hope one day Germany says screw the world and goes back to being staunch nationalists.
Kultur 9
Hallo,
Surprisingly, the articles this time were less frivolous and meaningless. Ich habe die Nachbar artikel mögen. Ruhezeit ist ein gute Vorstellung, aber die andere dinge war nicht so interessant.
Ich habe auch die 'Bureaucracy' artikel mögen. Ich meine, dass es ist schwierig auf Deutschland. Sie müssen ein computer und ein 'country-wide database' kaufen. Warum muss alles ganz etwas wissen?
Switching to english now, I certainly see how patriotism is a problem for germany, but it just goes to show how much Germany has changed. Many countries, after their members commit an atrocity of some kind, tend to try to hush it up, and pretend like it never happened. However, Germans have taken responsibility for things that have happened, and have subsequently become less patriotic. The world would probably be a much better place were more people to feel bad about things that had been done.
Tschuss!
Surprisingly, the articles this time were less frivolous and meaningless. Ich habe die Nachbar artikel mögen. Ruhezeit ist ein gute Vorstellung, aber die andere dinge war nicht so interessant.
Ich habe auch die 'Bureaucracy' artikel mögen. Ich meine, dass es ist schwierig auf Deutschland. Sie müssen ein computer und ein 'country-wide database' kaufen. Warum muss alles ganz etwas wissen?
Switching to english now, I certainly see how patriotism is a problem for germany, but it just goes to show how much Germany has changed. Many countries, after their members commit an atrocity of some kind, tend to try to hush it up, and pretend like it never happened. However, Germans have taken responsibility for things that have happened, and have subsequently become less patriotic. The world would probably be a much better place were more people to feel bad about things that had been done.
Tschuss!
Kultur 9
In my experience with Germans, all of the readings seemed appropriate.
My first response to the document article was, "WHAT IF I HAVE A HOUSE FIRE?!" It terrifies me that everything is kept in paper format, with the requirement of a signature or two, otherwise you're out of luck. Even our class's talk of Scheins terrified me, I would never rely on one piece paper to prove the classes that I've taken or the grade that I'd gotten. Although this system would solve my ever present wonder of "I wonder how many people lie on their resumes...."
I don't think that would be very possible, or wise, in Germany.
The articles on neighbors though seems appropriate though. My take away from Germany and Germans was that they are clean, clean people. And I suppose noise can be just as much as a disturbance as waste on the ground to some. It was funny to read about the frog being a nuisance, because I high school teacher was called in for jury duty over a case about a dog barking too loud. So it can happen here too.
And noting lastly on the online texts, I think that it is appropriate, or at least understandable that Germans have never developed a strong, loud, bursting display of German pride. What happened around WWII would cause anyone to be wary of getting too politically proud or roused up. There should be nothing to criticize there but to respect their decisions to keep flags to a minimum.
I don't think that would be very possible, or wise, in Germany.
The articles on neighbors though seems appropriate though. My take away from Germany and Germans was that they are clean, clean people. And I suppose noise can be just as much as a disturbance as waste on the ground to some. It was funny to read about the frog being a nuisance, because I high school teacher was called in for jury duty over a case about a dog barking too loud. So it can happen here too.
And noting lastly on the online texts, I think that it is appropriate, or at least understandable that Germans have never developed a strong, loud, bursting display of German pride. What happened around WWII would cause anyone to be wary of getting too politically proud or roused up. There should be nothing to criticize there but to respect their decisions to keep flags to a minimum.
As for the book material, Vienna/ Wien sounds beautiful. Vienna has always intrigued me, so it was nice to read a bit about it.
However the next article reiterated my (sort of) fear of German schooling set ups. What if you don't know what you want to be when you're 13 or 14 when you choose your "high school" path? As good as it sounds to have a straight path, I would be that kid that changes his/her mind halfway through technical school, ruining my own self directed path. Terrifying.
Lastly, Österreich sounds lovely as well, but thats may just be because I'm a sucker for any place on water, and the Danube also sounds beautiful.
Quite the mix of material (per usual) but very interesting!
Quite the mix of material (per usual) but very interesting!
Kultur 9
My friend who is in an advanced-level professional German class right now was telling me about the resumes they have to make, and how detailed they have to be. He said that on their resumes they have to put things like their martial status and religion. I would initially be offended if someone asked me that in a job interview, but now I know that that is customary and no offense should be taken.
I did think it was odd that certificates of completion for classes were given in a physical format. I guess this explains it a bit better, if that is how everything is run and that everyone has a binder full of the necessary tickets. I would be so bad at that, I lose everything, especially things like bills and letters and homework.
Eleven 11-year-olds? I think my blood pressure just rose. I know it is sweet, but I can imagine that that could be VERY loud. I still don't think it's right to complain about though. Those other cases sound funny. It seems like a waste to put so much time, effort and money into something so silly. But if it's what it takes to keep the peace--!? I think in America people generally put up with it, and it is hard if they want to try to take action against a neighbor. Wait, you can't use "house or garden appliances" from 8 pm to 7 am???!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!??!?!?!?!?!?!?!?
I just absolutely cannot believe that. No one would live in Germany if that were true. That would be seriously so inconvenient and it seems like such an invasion of privacy. And an infringement upon freedom. Is that rule only for specific areas? Like maybe one cul-de-sac??? You're not usually allowed to wash your car because of the chemicals? Do they drink from puddles? Who hates the smell of barbeque? Woah how can I make noise outside until 10 pm if "quiet time" starts at 8? I think this guy/girl is making this up. We don't have the same sidewalk rules, they are owned by the state, not us. That would suck if someone could sue you for not doing your lawn chores and shoveling snow quickly enough. In summary: I think this article is a load of baloney, more so than usual.
The one about flags was very interesting. I think that part of it is that in general Americans fly more flags than some parts of Europe. France for example, doesn't use flags as often as America does. (At least according to my own experience and the people I've talked to). It's so odd to think of shying away from your own flag, because here it is incorporated so much into our lives. I even have a little metal flag hanging outside the house I'm renting here in AA. It wasn't to make a statement, it's just...that's what you do. And there are flag lights and flag plates and flag-colored jello and flag dresses. It's something that you learn to identify with from a young age.
It's sad that loving your country in Germany has such negative connotations. Which makes me wonder about something I have thought of before: how is the Holocaust taught in Germany? Do they learn in kindergarten, in 7th grade like me, or do their parents tell them? How would you even go about telling kids about the terrible things that happened where they live? Do they use harsh, accurate words or do they say it in a paraphrased way? The article mentions how hardly anyone alive now was responsible for the Holocaust, so it makes me wonder how the story is told among themselves. Is it a story children grow up learning, the shame passed on to them from a young age? I guess that I actually grew up learning some pretty gruesome stories from the Bible, and I wasn't scarred. Do most Germans carry guilt about the Holocaust?
Questions to ponder.
I did think it was odd that certificates of completion for classes were given in a physical format. I guess this explains it a bit better, if that is how everything is run and that everyone has a binder full of the necessary tickets. I would be so bad at that, I lose everything, especially things like bills and letters and homework.
Eleven 11-year-olds? I think my blood pressure just rose. I know it is sweet, but I can imagine that that could be VERY loud. I still don't think it's right to complain about though. Those other cases sound funny. It seems like a waste to put so much time, effort and money into something so silly. But if it's what it takes to keep the peace--!? I think in America people generally put up with it, and it is hard if they want to try to take action against a neighbor. Wait, you can't use "house or garden appliances" from 8 pm to 7 am???!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!??!?!?!?!?!?!?!?
I just absolutely cannot believe that. No one would live in Germany if that were true. That would be seriously so inconvenient and it seems like such an invasion of privacy. And an infringement upon freedom. Is that rule only for specific areas? Like maybe one cul-de-sac??? You're not usually allowed to wash your car because of the chemicals? Do they drink from puddles? Who hates the smell of barbeque? Woah how can I make noise outside until 10 pm if "quiet time" starts at 8? I think this guy/girl is making this up. We don't have the same sidewalk rules, they are owned by the state, not us. That would suck if someone could sue you for not doing your lawn chores and shoveling snow quickly enough. In summary: I think this article is a load of baloney, more so than usual.
The one about flags was very interesting. I think that part of it is that in general Americans fly more flags than some parts of Europe. France for example, doesn't use flags as often as America does. (At least according to my own experience and the people I've talked to). It's so odd to think of shying away from your own flag, because here it is incorporated so much into our lives. I even have a little metal flag hanging outside the house I'm renting here in AA. It wasn't to make a statement, it's just...that's what you do. And there are flag lights and flag plates and flag-colored jello and flag dresses. It's something that you learn to identify with from a young age.
It's sad that loving your country in Germany has such negative connotations. Which makes me wonder about something I have thought of before: how is the Holocaust taught in Germany? Do they learn in kindergarten, in 7th grade like me, or do their parents tell them? How would you even go about telling kids about the terrible things that happened where they live? Do they use harsh, accurate words or do they say it in a paraphrased way? The article mentions how hardly anyone alive now was responsible for the Holocaust, so it makes me wonder how the story is told among themselves. Is it a story children grow up learning, the shame passed on to them from a young age? I guess that I actually grew up learning some pretty gruesome stories from the Bible, and I wasn't scarred. Do most Germans carry guilt about the Holocaust?
Questions to ponder.
Kultur 9
I found the article on the German certificate-obsession especially amusing because when my mom applied to get German citizenship for my sisters and I, it took several years for her to track down all the necessary documents (including her grandfather's marriage license!). We couldn't believe some of the stuff they were asking for to prove our German-ness - it seemed a little extreme.
The neighbors article was also a bit extreme. Then again, as a college student, I'm usually the one making the noise, not complaining about it. I think it's good to have some rules like this, and sometimes I wish my neighborhood at home had more - but having exact hours when you need to shovel snow, or saying that you can only barbeque once a month seems a little crazy. I think it's all about finding a balance, and like the article says, "you can't pick your neighbors," so if that's what it takes to keep the peace, then perhaps it's worth it.
The article about German patriotism was very interesting to read, because it's such an important and clearly delicate subject. It's sad to not be able to be proud of your country based on the past. However, I think I would be in the same situation - it would be very hard not to feel the shame attached to the atrocious events of World War II. I think sometimes Americans struggle with this, albeit to much lesser degree usually, after Bush's presidency. It's hard to have the entire world hate you for being a citizen of a country whose leader is viewed in a bad light. Definitely a difficult subject to deal with, and it seems like it'll be a while before German patriotism becomes accepted again.
Kultur 9
This chapters culture articles were interesting as per usual. I was least surprised by the article on the German obsession with certificates. This went right along with the practice of giving out a certificate upon the completion of a class. We have been taught over and over about the organizational traits that Germans posses and this feel right in line. Next, though I was unsurprised by the fact that relationships with your neighbor are spelled out in German law I was set aback by some of its aspects. For example, the limitation on grilling was almost shocking to me; I assumed that along with the love of meat came the love of grilling but apparently the Germans feel else-wise. Also, it seemed pretty overboard that a neighbor would be so bothered by a young girls birthday party, I could understand if it would have been older kids causing problems late at night but for eleven year olds it just seemed rude to complain. Finally, it seems as though patriotism is opposite in Germany from the US. Here if you are not outwardly patriotic it is almost always considered a bad thing, we disagree with our government oftentimes but everyone is quick to say how much they love the "real" America. This being said though, I can't say I'm shocked that Germans act this way towards patriotism, I just wonder if any sense of German patriotism will ever be common or if history has forever ruined this in Germany.
Kultur 9
I really enjoyed reading about Vienna and Austria. It is interesting to read about these different German speaking countries as they are so closely linked to Germany. I would love to visit the mountains of Austria.
I wish that our society here in America was as organized as Germans. More people should be conscious of their bills and certificates here. I think that the fact that Germans enjoy documenting and organizing their lives is very cool, and it is something the rest of the world should look to.
It is really weird/sad to see that Germans aren't patriotic. Even though World War II ended over 60 years ago, it is still obvious that Germans are somewhat still ashamed of their past. They might not show their patriotism through appreciation of their national flag, but they do show it through sports and things like the world cup.
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